In this PoYB mini-series, "First Photo," we explore the broad idea of nostalgia via a discussion about the very first Facebook photo you were ever tagged in. This our third entry (here's the first, and here's the second). PoYB contributor and sister-in-law Laura C**** was kind enough to chat with me about her first photo.
(A note about the structure of this interview: We started the chat via email, stretched out over a few weeks, and eventually ran out of time, so it was finished up in person on 4/4/21. I don't feel like I have to note where that transition takes place, as it should be obvious, but we'll see.)
The picture:
Tagged:
9/7/06
Discussion:
Joe: Okay, so I'm tempted to start right off the bat with asking you about your opinion of Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls, but let's save the heavy stuff for later. Where was this photo taken? Assuming that you weren't actually in a jungle somewhere.
Laura: So this photo was taken in Disney World on a vacation with my family and another family that were close family friends. I think it was in the Hollywood Studios part of Disney to be exact.
Joe: I'm sure you remember a lot or most of that vacation, but do you remember that photo being taken specifically? Like, literally do you remember posing at an Ace Ventura display and someone snapping a pic with their '90s non-digital camera?
Laura: I remember playing on the display and laughing at some of our friends' poses, so I know we were going to take a picture as you do on a Disney vacation. But I can’t say I remember anyone pulling out a camera and taking that specific picture at that specific moment. I can remember what the camera looked like that took that picture though, as it was a pretty standard at each of my '90s childhood events.
Joe: And you mentioned that you were with some family friends. Who are they? Did you guys go on vacation together often?
Laura: Our family was on vacation with the Fishers. [first names] and their parents. [Male sibling] Fisher was my age, **** was Pam’s age, and ********* was a few years older. So we were pretty close with them throughout early childhood. Their mom, Bridget, babysat us pretty often, but even outside of babysitting, we spent a lot of time with them when I was between three and six years old. Once we moved to the burbs, we didn’t see them too often, but still kept in touch as much as we could before technology. This was our one and only vacation together.
Joe: Assumptions based solely on a 20-year-old picture: the blonde girl is too cool for this, the brunette girl is disappointed that these aren't real monkeys, Fisher has mixed emotions about Jim Carrey trying to kiss him. And Pam is trying really hard not to personify the Taz on her shirt by smiling nicely.
Laura: Sounds about right! By the way, Pam used to LOVE Taz, so that shirt is very fitting of her wardrobe during this era.
Joe: I asked Pam about the Taz thing. She didn't deny it. The way Martha acts sometimes, I can see that she is the daughter of a Tasmanian Devil.
Laura: Martha and Jude are one in the same.
Laura: So this photo was taken in Disney World on a vacation with my family and another family that were close family friends. I think it was in the Hollywood Studios part of Disney to be exact.
Joe: I'm sure you remember a lot or most of that vacation, but do you remember that photo being taken specifically? Like, literally do you remember posing at an Ace Ventura display and someone snapping a pic with their '90s non-digital camera?
Laura: I remember playing on the display and laughing at some of our friends' poses, so I know we were going to take a picture as you do on a Disney vacation. But I can’t say I remember anyone pulling out a camera and taking that specific picture at that specific moment. I can remember what the camera looked like that took that picture though, as it was a pretty standard at each of my '90s childhood events.
Joe: And you mentioned that you were with some family friends. Who are they? Did you guys go on vacation together often?
Laura: Our family was on vacation with the Fishers. [first names] and their parents. [Male sibling] Fisher was my age, **** was Pam’s age, and ********* was a few years older. So we were pretty close with them throughout early childhood. Their mom, Bridget, babysat us pretty often, but even outside of babysitting, we spent a lot of time with them when I was between three and six years old. Once we moved to the burbs, we didn’t see them too often, but still kept in touch as much as we could before technology. This was our one and only vacation together.
Joe: Assumptions based solely on a 20-year-old picture: the blonde girl is too cool for this, the brunette girl is disappointed that these aren't real monkeys, Fisher has mixed emotions about Jim Carrey trying to kiss him. And Pam is trying really hard not to personify the Taz on her shirt by smiling nicely.
Laura: Sounds about right! By the way, Pam used to LOVE Taz, so that shirt is very fitting of her wardrobe during this era.
Joe: I asked Pam about the Taz thing. She didn't deny it. The way Martha acts sometimes, I can see that she is the daughter of a Tasmanian Devil.
Laura: Martha and Jude are one in the same.
Joe: This all reminds me though---what's up with the white shirts on everyone? Just coincidence? White shirts for the Florida heat?
Laura: I didn’t even notice that everyone had on white shirts! It could definitely have been a tactic for the Florida sun and heat, or just that baggy '90s white Ts were really in.
Joe: So do we have an exact date for this pic? Or an approximate one at least? It's tougher than usual because clearly it had been years and years between the vacation and its posting on FB.
Laura: That’s a tough one. I believe I was in third grade and that the trip was in October. So approximately October 1995 I’d say.
Joe: Tell me a little bit about what life was like back then.
Laura: The '90s were great! Pam and I spent a lot of time riding bikes, playing outside and on our swing set, and playing with the neighborhood kids. TGIF and SNICK were at their prime, so there was always something to look forward to on TV, too. Blockbuster was also a standard at our house for the weekends, especially if we just got a report card because then we could get a free rental. No computers, but we did have Sega and regularly played Sonic and Aladdin, so life was good.
Joe: So do we have an exact date for this pic? Or an approximate one at least? It's tougher than usual because clearly it had been years and years between the vacation and its posting on FB.
Laura: That’s a tough one. I believe I was in third grade and that the trip was in October. So approximately October 1995 I’d say.
Joe: Tell me a little bit about what life was like back then.
Laura: The '90s were great! Pam and I spent a lot of time riding bikes, playing outside and on our swing set, and playing with the neighborhood kids. TGIF and SNICK were at their prime, so there was always something to look forward to on TV, too. Blockbuster was also a standard at our house for the weekends, especially if we just got a report card because then we could get a free rental. No computers, but we did have Sega and regularly played Sonic and Aladdin, so life was good.
In third grade, school was easy. However, I actually failed a test due to this vacation which will forever live in my nightmares. I missed all the content that was taught, came back from vacation and had to take the test. It was about the solar system. I even got called out for choosing an obviously wrong answer to a question about the distance between earth and the sun during a lecture from our teacher. Apparently a lot of kids didn’t score well on the test which was why we got lectured. But I bounced back and even met my elementary school best friend this year in class.
Joe: Oh man, that's pretty funny, because I also have a specific memory of failing a science test in fourth grade when I came back from Disney World. Which is fucking insane to think about, how teachers expected you too study... on your own... at Disney World.
Joe: Oh man, that's pretty funny, because I also have a specific memory of failing a science test in fourth grade when I came back from Disney World. Which is fucking insane to think about, how teachers expected you too study... on your own... at Disney World.
Laura:
That’s pretty wild that that happened to both of us. It really is so
crazy that you’re expected to do schoolwork on a Disney vacation. I can
understand if you were traveling for like a personal/family reason for
an extended period of time, but I think you can let one week at Disney
fly, right?
Joe: But thanks for giving a good picture of life in 1995. The reason I ask is because I'm trying to understand how you feel about seeing this picture at other times in your life, and reflect upon what life was like at that time. So when the picture was posted by Fisher in September 2006: 1) in what measurable ways had your life changed by that point? and 2) were you old enough in 2006 to appreciate how much things had changed by that point?
Laura: When this picture was posted in 2006, my life had changed a lot. For one, we didn’t keep in touch with the Fishers too frequently anymore, but on no bad terms. I can expect that seeing this pop up on "The Facebook" brought back some really good memories of the times we spent with Fisher and his family. I probably had just signed up for Facebook at this point so that was exciting as well.
In 2006, I was now finishing my freshman year of college vs. starting third grade and had grown up a lot. I could probably now handle teaching myself about the solar system on my own time and acing a test. I definitely feel like I had an appreciation for my elementary school years, especially with the new added stress of navigating college and a life/work balance all on my own.
Joe: And now how about in 2021? I feel like even describing it as "The Facebook" probably brings back some nostalgia for 2006. Do you feel a stronger sense of nostalgia for 2006 or 1995? And did you ever have that reunion that you requested in a comment under the picture when it was posted?
Laura: My life has definitely changed even more between now and 2006 than from the time this photo was taken till 2006. In 2021, I feel nostalgia still, but I can also look at this picture and other photos like this and visualize my own kids at similar fun events and vacations with friends and family. So it’s now not only nostalgia but also a sense of looking forward to reliving these memories through Layla and Jude.
I’d have to say that right now, in 2021 while taking care of two toddlers/young kids during a global pandemic, I have more of a longing for 2006 me. 1995 was great as a kid, but in 2006 I had the freedom to basically do what I wanted when I wanted. I love my kids, but right now even going to Giant is hard (masks and hand sanitizer aside). I’m sure you know the feeling.
Regarding our F*****-McD***** reunion, I don’t think that ever happened, at least not all together like I’m sure I imagined back then. I know Pam has run into Kate in Port Richmond, and we’ve all had friendly exchanges on social media, but have we gotten together and maybe had a few drinks? Sadly, no. It still would be nice though.
Joe: Yeah, it's kinda funny, I've been running into Fisher a lot more often than you and Pammy have, at least in my weird little blog corner of the internet. A mutual friend roped him into a recent Casablanca discussion, and only then did we realize that we were connected through the McD***** family. It seemed like kismet that he was the one that posted this pic, your first FB pic—especially because he had mentioned Ace Ventura to me in an email, before he even knew this blog feature about "first photos" even existed—so I hit him up and asked him about it. One thing he mentioned was that Mr. F***** had won some money on Jeopardy, and that's how they paid for the trip, which I thought was pretty funny.
Laura: It’s crazy how things always come back around. I also remember Mr. Fisher being on Jeopardy and what a big deal it was to all of us at the time. It’s still pretty cool. I remember he won a few days in a row so he must have been pretty good! I never knew the connection that the winnings paid for their Disney trip. That’s pretty awesome!
Joe: The other thing that Fisher told me was that he considered Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls being "important to [his] comedic development." So I guess this is as good a time as any for you to talk about the movie. Have you seen it? Had you seen it then? Was it more "We have to get a picture with Ace and the monkey characters" or "this seems like a fun opportunity for a photo with the gang"?
Laura: Ace Ventura is definitely very on-point for Fisher's type of humor. It’s been a while but I can still gather (from Facebook posts and such) that his sense of humor is along the same lines as when we were kids. I have seen both Ace Ventura and Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls. Before this trip may have been the first and last time I saw Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls. Jim Carey was a big deal back then, but I think I preferred The Mask to the Ace Ventura movies. I’m sure getting a picture with this cut out was more of a fun opportunity than anything else and a way to kill time between rides, food, and everything else.
Joe: But thanks for giving a good picture of life in 1995. The reason I ask is because I'm trying to understand how you feel about seeing this picture at other times in your life, and reflect upon what life was like at that time. So when the picture was posted by Fisher in September 2006: 1) in what measurable ways had your life changed by that point? and 2) were you old enough in 2006 to appreciate how much things had changed by that point?
Laura: When this picture was posted in 2006, my life had changed a lot. For one, we didn’t keep in touch with the Fishers too frequently anymore, but on no bad terms. I can expect that seeing this pop up on "The Facebook" brought back some really good memories of the times we spent with Fisher and his family. I probably had just signed up for Facebook at this point so that was exciting as well.
In 2006, I was now finishing my freshman year of college vs. starting third grade and had grown up a lot. I could probably now handle teaching myself about the solar system on my own time and acing a test. I definitely feel like I had an appreciation for my elementary school years, especially with the new added stress of navigating college and a life/work balance all on my own.
Joe: And now how about in 2021? I feel like even describing it as "The Facebook" probably brings back some nostalgia for 2006. Do you feel a stronger sense of nostalgia for 2006 or 1995? And did you ever have that reunion that you requested in a comment under the picture when it was posted?
Laura: My life has definitely changed even more between now and 2006 than from the time this photo was taken till 2006. In 2021, I feel nostalgia still, but I can also look at this picture and other photos like this and visualize my own kids at similar fun events and vacations with friends and family. So it’s now not only nostalgia but also a sense of looking forward to reliving these memories through Layla and Jude.
I’d have to say that right now, in 2021 while taking care of two toddlers/young kids during a global pandemic, I have more of a longing for 2006 me. 1995 was great as a kid, but in 2006 I had the freedom to basically do what I wanted when I wanted. I love my kids, but right now even going to Giant is hard (masks and hand sanitizer aside). I’m sure you know the feeling.
Regarding our F*****-McD***** reunion, I don’t think that ever happened, at least not all together like I’m sure I imagined back then. I know Pam has run into Kate in Port Richmond, and we’ve all had friendly exchanges on social media, but have we gotten together and maybe had a few drinks? Sadly, no. It still would be nice though.
Joe: Yeah, it's kinda funny, I've been running into Fisher a lot more often than you and Pammy have, at least in my weird little blog corner of the internet. A mutual friend roped him into a recent Casablanca discussion, and only then did we realize that we were connected through the McD***** family. It seemed like kismet that he was the one that posted this pic, your first FB pic—especially because he had mentioned Ace Ventura to me in an email, before he even knew this blog feature about "first photos" even existed—so I hit him up and asked him about it. One thing he mentioned was that Mr. F***** had won some money on Jeopardy, and that's how they paid for the trip, which I thought was pretty funny.
Laura: It’s crazy how things always come back around. I also remember Mr. Fisher being on Jeopardy and what a big deal it was to all of us at the time. It’s still pretty cool. I remember he won a few days in a row so he must have been pretty good! I never knew the connection that the winnings paid for their Disney trip. That’s pretty awesome!
Joe: The other thing that Fisher told me was that he considered Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls being "important to [his] comedic development." So I guess this is as good a time as any for you to talk about the movie. Have you seen it? Had you seen it then? Was it more "We have to get a picture with Ace and the monkey characters" or "this seems like a fun opportunity for a photo with the gang"?
Laura: Ace Ventura is definitely very on-point for Fisher's type of humor. It’s been a while but I can still gather (from Facebook posts and such) that his sense of humor is along the same lines as when we were kids. I have seen both Ace Ventura and Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls. Before this trip may have been the first and last time I saw Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls. Jim Carey was a big deal back then, but I think I preferred The Mask to the Ace Ventura movies. I’m sure getting a picture with this cut out was more of a fun opportunity than anything else and a way to kill time between rides, food, and everything else.
Joe: I feel like I read that email at four in the morning. You have a positive opinion about Ace Ventura, or a negative opinion about Ace Ventura?
Laura: A neutral opinion. [laughter]
Pam: Have you watched it recently? It doesn't hold up.
Laura: I only watched it when it came out.
Joe: And we're only talking about When Nature Calls specifically. The second one. That's the one where this photo takes place.
Laura: I've definitely only seen it once or twice.
Pam: It takes place in Africa or something, right?
Laura: I just remember the part with the poop.
Pam: It probably also doesn't hold up well.
Laura: It takes place in the jungle.
Joe: We can assume there was racist depictions of "savages"?
Laura: Yes.
Joe: But that's not something you'd be thinking about when you're in grade school, taking a picture.
Laura: No!
Joe: You're thinking about how cool the animals are. One of the animals was a giraffe.
Laura: Was there a giraffe in that picture? I thought it was just monkeys.
Joe: There are a bunch of monkeys, a giraffe, a toucan. You had a thing about giraffes when you were little, right?
Laura: Yes, I did like giraffes.
Joe: Was that something you were excited about? Taking a picture with a giraffe?
Laura: ...Probably? [laughter]
Pam: [sarcastic] These are good questions, Joe.
Joe: Well this is what this feature entails! We're talking about the details of the picture!
Willow: [screams in another room]
Joe: Why did you like giraffes when you were that age?
Laura: I don't know! I think I just did. They're not aggressive or anything. They're not harmful.
Joe: It's funny, when me and Pam were talking about the Tasmanian Devil thing, how you just attach yourself to certain things when you're younger. "This is what I like, this is what I don't like."
Pam: "This is my brand."
Joe: Exactly.
Laura: And that was it! Mine was a giraffe.
Joe: I used to bust [my brother-in-law] Bob's balls, because one of those things for me when I was this age was Pepsi. Like, Pepsi products. I don't know why.
Laura: That's weird. [laughter]
Joe: Absolutely. And there's a picture at my birthday sleepover, and me and my friends are all Pepsi yo-yos. Pepsi and Mountain Dew.
Laura: I guess I do remember Pepsi being a thing. The "Pepsi/Coke Challenge." Remember that?
Joe: No. That was a thing?
Laura: Yeah, around that time. You would put Pepsi and Coke in unmarked glasses, and taste them, and then see which one you liked better. It was cool to like Pepsi better, for some reason?
Joe: Was it cool to like Ace Ventura back then?
Laura: I guess so!
Joe: Was Ace Ventura the Pepsi of Jim Carrey movies? Versus The Mask and Dumb and Dumber?
Laura: To some people. I don't know, Dumb and Dumber was probably the best.
Joe: The Coke of Jim Carrey movies. Or the Royal Cola.
Laura: [laughter] Right.
Joe: I guess we already talked about how much of that vacation you remember. I should've reread the emails before we talked today.
Laura: I don't remember much beyond the pictures, honestly.
Joe: Do you look back on that vacation fondly? Or just like, "That's a thing that happened"?
Laura: Probably just a thing that happened. But it was fun! I don't think it was anything super-amazing. It was Disney World. You know.
Joe: I guess I'm leading up the idea of pictures "capturing" something. Like, we were taking a bunch of Easter pictures today with the kids. We were capturing a good day that we were having. We're in the middle of a pandemic, everyone here is finally vaccinated, we're taking pictures of our kids, in order to say: "That was a good-ass day." But are pictures always like that? Or—do pictures have to be like that? Or can it just be: This is a thing that happened.
Laura: I guess they can be "this is a thing that happened."
Joe: And... I haven't done too many of these features, so I can't even remember if I spoke to this in the other two. Was that an important part of Facebook? To be able to capture that? Like, the fact that Fisher posted it, and now we're talking about it, two decades later, is that—
Laura: Well I think that's when Facebook first started.
Joe: It was different.
Laura: You put up more stuff. You made albums.
Joe: That was exciting, when you got tagged in a picture! Back in the day.
Laura: And now it's like, whatever. Everyone just puts up whatever, and then it disappears.
Joe: I haven't been on Facebook since last summer. Do you feel like the pace in which you are tagged in a picture has considerably slowed since you were younger?
Laura: Yes! And I also untagged myself from a bunch of stuff when I joined the sorority. Because we weren't allowed to have alcohol in pictures.
Joe: [laughter] Oh my god.
Laura: So I had to untag myself. I'm missing so many pictures when I was in. I wish I didn't untag myself. Now if I'm looking for something or somebody, I don't even have a picture of it. There's no trace.
Martha: [grabs Joe's notes]
Joe: Stop that! I definitely like looking back at old photos. And I definitely think more fondly about those times than I would've if there wasn't a photo of that event. I wonder if you would give a shit about that vacation that you took, had there not been a picture of you guys chilling with Jim Carrey.
Laura: Yeah. I mean it probably wouldn't be as significant. I wouldn't remember that, specifically, if there wasn't a picture of it. I would probably just remember we went on vacation with family friends.
Joe: And it's interesting too that the picture is with a family that you're not necessarily hanging out with all the time now. Just the idea of people coming in and out of your life, and looking at these types of pictures and being like, "Those were my friends then." And they're not your friends now. Not that you don't like them, obviously, but, like, you wouldn't hit Fisher up and be like "Let's meet up at the bar" or something, I assume.
Laura: No, yeah. I feel like that's a lot of Facebook too. My Facebook, anyway. I don't keep in touch with a lot of people I'm tagged in pictures with a long time ago.
Joe: Do you feel like—I mean, I don't even know, I guess you don't have any contact with Fisher whatsoever? Only secondhand through your brother-in-law and his dumb blog shit?
Laura: Yeah, that or if I ever commented on anything on his Facebook. That's probably it.
Joe: And just how someone stays in your consciousness because of a picture. Maybe you wouldn't even remember any given person from your life if it wasn't for that. There are plenty of people—I mean, there are probably people who I haven't seen in ten years, like from high school. A year ago, I only remembered their existence because of Facebook. And now, maybe there are people who are completely lost to me. Like, I wouldn't even recognize them in the supermarket.
Laura: Definitely. That's crazy.
Joe: Do you feel like... sorry, and I can feel myself starting to believe that I'm being philosophical here, even those it's just that I'm three drinks deep. This isn't that deep.
Laura: I'm just making sure that Layla's not running down the steps right now.
Pam: I have her.
Joe: Okay, so if the idea of "first photo" is important—which it might not be! But for the purposes of this blog post, it is. Is this a worthy First Photo? Is this a photo worthy of discussion? Or, would there be another photo that would have resulted in a better discussion?
Laura: I think it's worthy of discussion, because it's just a weird picture to be on Facebook. But it's not an accurate depiction of what a typical first photo on Facebook would be. Because it's not in the era of Facebook!
Joe: That's true.
Laura: It doesn't correlate with the whole idea of Facebook. It's more like—what's the point of that picture being on Facebook at all?
Joe: That's a good point. Most of the other first photos I've looked at have been just them and another person, drinking.
Laura: "This happened around the time you got Facebook, because you were tagged, and we were so cool back then." This is: "This was vacation in third grade." [laughter]
Pam: My first picture—speaking of things that don't hold up—is a Cowboys and Indians Party. All I did was borrow a shirt from [college friend] Juliet that said "Save a Horse, Ride a Cowboy." I did not dress up like an Indian.
Joe: You did not culturally appropriate.
Pam: No. There is no one in the photo dressed as an Indian.
Joe: I wonder if Jim Carrey did any cultural appropriating in this movie.
Pam: I would say yes.
Laura: Yeah. There's a whole thing with the tribe, right? He gets captured by them, or something. The first thing was pretty bad too, with the transphobia.
Joe: But I don't think any of that comes through in the photo.
Laura: [laughter] No! It's monkeys!
Pam: Universal Studios was a family park. It wasn't anything racy about the movie. It was anything wholesome from the movie. He's saving animals!
Joe: Even if there was like a tribesman depicted in the photo, I don't necessarily think that would've come off as bad. When I see the photo, I see a group of five kids who hang out, get along, and are just having a good time because their parents get along.
Laura: Yeah, there's nothing bad about it.
Joe: Which is cool.
Laura: Better than other first photos, I'm sure.
Willow: [more yelling]
Joe: Okay, we'll wrap it up... sorry, I don't even know where my notes are, I think Martha ripped them up. Do you feel like the fact that I—I mean, I couldn't find any other pictures from this particular vacation online. Do you feel like it is a disservice—to our own kids, or other people, or our friends or whatever, on Facebook—that there might be a hundred photos from a particular vacation? Like, does this particular photo have more value because there is only one, as opposed to many different pictures from this vacation and from many different Jim Carrey movies?
Laura: Probably! I guess because it's all of the kids in it. It's not just me and Pammy, which we have a million pictures of.
Pam: There are a hundred pictures from that vacation.
Laura: They're just not on Facebook.
Joe: I mean, you could open up a tin box in your parents' garage and find a bunch of photos. But someone like me, who is much removed from that time in your and Pam's lives, and that particular vacation, I see that photo and know that you guys were having a good time. Whereas if I saw a hundred photos from that vacation, I would care much less about that vacation.
Laura: It's interesting why this photo is even there.
Joe: I guess that thought it somewhat removed from the idea of Facebook photos, and is more about photos in general. Well, okay, removed from the context of Facebook, what value do you take from this photo?
Laura: Just that it was a nice memory that we have with that family, and that we were close at that time. I think it's pretty cool to go on vacation with your friends when you're that old. Usually it's just family. It was fun and different for us.
Joe: Do you feel like this was the only photo that anyone ever saw of Laura C****, do you feel like it accurately represents what is important to you?
Laura: No. [laughter]
Pam: With your Tweety Bird shirt.
Laura: No.
Joe: No? Family? And giraffes?
Laura: The shirt I had on was a chocolate lab shirt. For Dallas [our dog growing up].
Joe: If we assume that—okay, let's assume that we tag the four monkeys in the photo as Layla, Jude, Willow, and Martha, now does it accurately represent Laura C****? Steve's the giraffe.
Laura: I guess! Now that everyone is in it.
